MohanDas Gandhi was the one who brought us freedom??

I don't know if I am picking a controversial topic..Sorry If I am...

But People always says the Mahatma Gandhi did so much for us..Call him Bapu and so on... I've seen people believeing in him like some kind of God...
OK he did something for India but He was not the only one. Why people don't Remember and talk about Netaji Subhash Chandra Bose , Bhagat Singh ChandraShekhar Azad as much as they do for MohanDas Gandhi..

There were so much things negetive about that man...

What are your views?

My exact Question is :

Is it OK to give all credit of freedom to MohanDas Gandhi?

WWII gave us our freedom.

he was not the only one... there are lot of others behind him..

its just like.. bill gates is the one who found M$... but we exactly dont know how many are behind him

He was one of them and had his unique way (i dont agree of it).
There were others also as Quiz_Master mentioned them.
I also agree with Arsenal_Gunners that WW2 was in a way helpful for us to get our freedom.

S

NO NO NO,he was responsible for the death of Bhagat Singh,Rajguru and Sukhdev.
Nathuram did right.We all know what he did.
Netaji Subhash,Pt,Jawaharlal Nehru and Chandrashekhar Azad as u mentioned played a major role in our independence.
Satyagrahas didnt do any gud.
I totally oppose Gandhi.
whatever anyone says.

@sachin-yaar thread quiz_master ne start kiya hai qwerty ne nahi.

Arsenal_Gunners said:
WWII gave us our freedom.

1000000000% correct.

Read some Gopalacharya and u will find the logics all laid out. However i did not like the way he dismissed Netaji's contribution.

Yes Gandhiji, did pay his role. But to give all the credit to him is, well........i don't know, insulting all other freedom fighters.

abtom said:
@sachin-yaar thread quiz_master ne start kiya hai qwerty ne nahi.

OOPS!

Edited.

Btw. It is not the fault of MK Gandhi if people give credit to him.
Personally I respect him.

Gandhi was just an opportunist , Jinnah was better and efficient than Gandhi ,
there are many works of gandhi which are questionable

R

I agree with abtom. And i hate Gandhi.

Nehru and Gandhi two biggest villains of India , made mess of this country ...

I've read Gandhi's Autobiography (official as published by Gandhi foundation). In that he says it pains him that people call him the mahatma. And yet we "respect" him by calling him EXACTLY THAT. You can get a copy at your local bookstore of The Story of my Experiments with Truth by MK Gandhi. Nice book, he is quite honest in it.

I have seen some people abusing Mahatama Gandhi.And i have also heard that Jawaharlal Nehru was also not liked by many people.

I wouldn't want to abuse him. He was a pacifist and played his role in the freedom struggle. At the same time we cannot over glorify him. Once you read his book you will realize that he was a little eccentric too. I guess the line between genius and insanity is very thin

As for nehru, well it is said that he died of tertiary syphilis affecting his aorta. Unfortunately no one likes to talk about these things. Just google for
nehru syphilis
You'll be surprised

Ya it was the WW 2. Britain had lost heavily in the war. They couldn't sustain the colonies. So they were on a de-colonizing spree.

I hate gandhi. Give all credit to GARAM DAL for freedom. Aazadi haath jodne se nahin milti uske liye ladna padta hai.

it was mainly WWII as someone earlier said -that speeds up freedom for India(and Pak).
Now the opposite is happening Indians&p0kis are flooding Europe and esp Britain(and british are really pissed off by us

!)
@nucleuskore:I do remember the photo showing Nehru acting so romantic to lure Mount Batton's wife.
and amazed to hear that he died of syphilis!

Oh my Oh my...

I can't believe so many of you have thinking like me on this matter. Actually I posted this because in my class everyone is like "Gandhi Bhakt" so I wanted to get some solid points against all this "Gandhi was only one" crap...

What I think is MohanDas Gandhi actually slow down our independence. Not even that there were some big faults in his character :

1.) The Indian National Congress wanted Sardar Vallabhai Patel to lead Independent India but he was asked by Gandhi to not to stand for the same as he wanted Jawarharlal Nehru to be India's first leader.
Patel was much suited candidate.

2.) Gandhi didn't approve Netaji Subhash Chandra Bose because Gandhi considered his methods as "not adhering to his concept of Ahimsa". This leader thus didn't get much support from the Indian National Congress because of this attitude on Gandhi's part.
Later he formed the Indian National Army and fought against the British in the Second World War. And you all allready said the importance of WWII in our freedom.

3.) Whats more... We know how violent and cruel Hitler was. Still Gandhi called him, "My Beloved Brother".

Gandhi never seemed to have realised the great danger that Nazism represented for humanity.
Read the 13th para here
*www.rediff.com/news/1999/aug/13india.htm
(Or read the whole article, Its an eye opener.)

4.) One of the main reasons why Hindu fundamentalists were against Gandhi was due to the fact while Gandhi was prompt in his protest and criticism of Hindu violence against Moslems in India, he didn't even protest or censure the Pakistani government or the Moslems concerning violence against Hindus.

5.) Nothuram Godse's statement at his trial can be read HERE.
There he said

Gandhi is being referred to as the Father of the Nation. But if that
is so, he had failed his paternal duty inasmuch as he has acted very
treacherously to the nation by his consenting to the partitioning of it.

Exactly. Who father will want his son/daughter to cut it in half.

Enough Said ~~

Gandhi was not a hero he was a common man who contributed to this country as much as any common man did that time(Well he contributed even less then a common man). And he shouldn't get all that attention he is getting.

(Sorry if what I said hurt anyone... But what I said is true facts... Google it

)

so now people like digging grave again ?

bharat_r said:
Ya it was the WW 2. Britain had lost heavily in the war. They couldn't sustain the colonies. So they were on a de-colonizing spree.

There also was a change of government to Labour in UK

I dont know how much true is the story which I am going to present. But this was told to me by a friend of mine who lives in Allahabad, the same city in which Chandrashekhar Azad commited suicide. The same place nowdays is called "shaheed park" and its located not far away from the residence of Pandit Nehru; " Anand Bhawan". The story was told to my friend by an old watchman of anand bhawan.

When the police was after Azad, he went to Nehru's house and asked for his help. But Nehru asked Azad to go out of his house as the former never wanted police to enter his house. He therefore, sent chandrashekar azad out of his house to the streets outside. It was that time when Azad went to the park and commited suicide (with the last bullet of his gun).

I dont know how much truth is there in the story and I do not guarantee about any facts but if it is to be believed, then its worth a tale.

gandhi and nehru were "politicians", i think that sums it up

^^
+1

but...M K Gandhi -his ideologies are still respected(ahimsa esp) around the world.

To an extent Gandhi gave British some trouble. But giving him full credit for the independence was non-sense. The most influential factor was world war II obviously so in effect Hitler is responsible for India's independence

.
People like Gandhi and Nehru were shrewd politicians. Gandhi should not be given so much credit that he gets. It is the current set of politicians that have projected him as a great national icon and a hero for their peronal agendas. I would not say that what Godse did was correct but Gandhi was definetely not the Hero that he is projected to be. Infact all the other people get masked because of him.
It is said that the people who enjoy the credit of any deed are not really the people who necessarily do the deed,
Anyways I have respect for him.

nightcrawler said:
It is the current set of politicians that have projected him as a great national icon and a hero for their peronal agendas

It is us who are studying Gandhi's life in young classes.for me atleast i remember "memoirs of gandhi" which i had studied in 8th or so.

Exactly. Thats the point, I mean why are we told about Gandhi again and again and again when there are other Historic Events happening in the world as well. Why is not it being changed? If you personally wish to study more about Gandhi that is fine but I for one remember here in Mumbai from standard 3rd I think or 4th to 10 we have had 3 or 4 encounters of Gandhi and 'His Freedom Struggle' when we could have studied more recent events in History or other events for example Chinese Civ or American Independence or Russian Civil War in more details.

even better the reality behind "Moplah rebellion,wagon tragedy" or "Khilafath Movement" -in kerala how many hindu's are looted and killed and converted

^^^we are taught in kerala that these are all "freedom struggles" but the reality is killing our own people.why cant the gov shows the power to get reality in history for kids

sry if it is offtopic.kids are learning wrong info. :-|

britishers are enemy for a particular area and for some religion.but in Travancore-Cochin states atleast it was british who saved from satanic ,Hyder ali,tippu from looting and conversion which they did in malabar

also lot of developments and english education.i am not justifying british.

It all comes down to the politicans and their wants and vote bank politics. This selective masking of history, glorifying certain things which are not necessary and not giving out the truth or falsification of truth or withholdng some information. It is for the people to see this things but most of the times politicans are successful in their motives and people become easily blinded. I hope that exposure to Internet opens people's eyes to real truth. Although Internet has been used to exploit and not necessarily everything on Internet and Wikipedia is true.

I had read a book written on the life of Nathuram Godse. It was written such that it felt like his autobiography. In that book it was written how he grew up and feelings for his country developed in him. And then when he came to know of Gandhi. There are some facts in that book that you'll never hear any where. He tells that he respected Gandhi for all the good he done. But he also knew that if Gandhi continued, he'll do more harm than good. Therefore he thought, to save his country, he must take some action and decided to kill gandhi. Also throughout the book, he referred to Gandhi's murder as 'Gandhi Vadh'. When you kill someone bad for a good reason and for everyones benefit, its called 'Vadh' in hindi/marathi.

He also mentiones, that although Gandhi wore a dhoti saying many people in india have no money for clothes, he also had a goat outside his house to get fresh goat milk which he had everyday with various expensive dry fruits, like almonds, etc. He also had a daily oil massage for his body. He also lead a pretty lavish life. All this was seen by Nathuram by his own eyes.

The biggest eye opener that i read in the book, the one which has been taught in school since ages, was the fact that Gandhi said "Hey Ram" before dying. Nathuram said that he was a few feet away when he died and if Gandhi had indeed said anything of that sort, he would've been the first to hear. But he said the Gandhi only made small sound (he had described the sound in the book, however i do not remember it) and then collapsed. It was the congress people who then spread the idea that Gandhi said "Hey Ram".

There are several such dirty secrets of our so-called Father of our nation in the book, however i do not remember it. Reading it did nothing else but fill me with hatred for Gandhi, for what he really was and what he was made out to be. The book was in Marathi named 'Sagara Agasti Alaa'. If anyone of you can read marathi, i definitely recommend you read this book. Its definitely an eye opener.

i think there are many people behind the freedom of india..
i think it dates back even b4 gandhi have started his fight..

i think everybody should be respected equally..
its just like we like sachin and forget about rp singh....
:-D

^^ Reported!

heil Hitler ///

Ein riech , ein voila , ein fuhrer

@ $$Gururaj$$

hope u control ur language here in this forum.. coz mods are very strict..especially the fat being and raboo

anyway reported ur prev post..

$$gururaj$$ : banned for a month. i warned you.. i tried to clean up your mess , but you wont listen.. come back after a month and learn how to behave..

ssdivisiongermany1933 said:
Nehru and Gandhi two biggest villains of India , made mess of this country ...

then whom do u consider the biggest hero LALLU PRASAD YADAV

and any how why to abuse gandhi???? no1 is perfect n 100% gud. only our views should be towards the goodness of the person. so i say instead of discreditin gandhi for everythin u should ask HOW MUCH HAV WE LEARNED GOOD FROM HIM AND HAS ANY1 OF US DONE ANY THING GOOD FOR OUR COUNTRY(atleast for selfish reasons as some1 here says that gandhi was a POLITICIAN)

we just believe wat others say about gandhi but has ANY ONE OF US DONE ATLEAST A GOD THING LIKE HIM.

Gandhi led us to get freedom. That doesnt mean that all the credit must go to him.
There were a lot of guys who helped.

We are not worthy to comment on these guys...

I think no one in this forum has the right to judge Gandhi , i mean you can say fraud to Mr.Gandhi if you want but have you done more one good things for the country than Gandhi ?, No actually no one has done even one good thing for the country still we criticize others, yeah Gandhi was a villan ok so what are you ? A Hero ? I think we need to change ourselves the world will change by itself , because the world is actually like the way we see it.

Edit : also some one mention that only leaders get acknowledged , my answer to him is that in this world only the one who showed us the way & the one who lead us the way are acknowledged , the followers are always ignored.

E.g when workers build buildings , do they get acknowledged for their work actually no one will remember their names & they will forgotten but Architect's name won't be forgotten because it was his ideas of building the building.

A

^^^
I might have done something surely if I had been born at that time

And I don't think even Gandhi could do anything in TODAY'S INDIA, even if he tried to. There's a lot of difference between India 60yrs ago and now.. Politicians have have totally $ucked our country.

Surely, I did "SOMETHING" for India.

* I never thought that INDIA must be partitioned.
* I never differentiated between Ram and Allah.
* I will never say "Hey RAM" while dieing and still people should call me greatest religion neutral !!

And again from one drama based on Nathuram Godase's life, he asked on question, "why u think, he said 'Hey RAM' when all says HE is a religion neutral" ?

Cyrus_the_virus said:
^^ Reported!

Reported for what?

For my signature huh.
Its not mine.
Its mininova website quote.
I liked it i am keeping it as my sig..did i post any website or torrent?

i think he reported guruji the guy who shantu banned for one month not you....

smit is right

naveen_reloaded said:
Reported for what?

For my signature huh.
Its not mine.
Its mininova website quote.
I liked it i am keeping it as my sig..did i post any website or torrent?

Are yaar, it wasn't your post. the post i reported got deleted. so now it's pointing at your post

sorry abt that

very funny situation!!! :mrgreen:

Hey man!!!I'm not a scientist. And I hate chemistry. And above all, I'm still alive. Change ur siggy dude.

Gandhi over hyped person

Gandhi JI was important and he still is...

Otherwise who would have given us "Lage raho munnabhai.."

Agar BABu nahi hote toh gandhigiri nahi hoti aur naa hoti ye movie..

(BUMP)
Arre.. I am kidding
I do not want to be in this discussion.

Read Biography of Mahatma Gandhi also read book by Rajmohan Gandhi on Bapu ji(Gandhi family member) then I feel this discussion will go right..
According to me, leave this topic and be Gandhi ji as Mahatma.

Ricky said:
According to me, leave this topic and be Gandhi ji as Mahatma.

I think, this discussion is for Gandhi ji OR Mahatma.
and NOT for Gandhi ji AS Mahatma.

Ama Yaar !!!.. this is what we are discussing .. is he worthy to be Mahatma !

.....

Nopes he doesn't deserve to be a Mahatama ... He is an over hyped person ,,,thats it

-same goes to J.Nehru too.but Indira was a powerful lady!
i added all above because of their gandhi tag!

+1 Prakash.

Indira Gandhi was really a powerful lady of Indian History and Politics.

^^^^ yeah she was not a politician at all like GANDHI

and yeah GANDHI WAS A BIG SUCKER N BIGGEST DEVIL OF THESE TIMES. HE DIDNT HELP IN BRINGIN FREEDOM AT ALL.HE A MERE SELFISH DEVIL WHO HAS NO REGARDS FOR HUMANITY N OUR COUNTRY.

WE SHOULD LANCH A NATION WIDE PROTEST AGAINST HIM AND HIS MAHATAMA-SHIP

are kambakhat!!! tum log jaante hi kitna ho gandhiji ke bare me jo unke piche pade ho. unke jaisa ek kaam bhi tum logo ne nahi kiya hoga????

ITS US WHO GAVE HIM TITLE OF MAHATAMA. HE HIMSILF TOLD THAT HE SHOULD NOT BE CALLED LIKE-WISE.

TUM LOGON SE ACHE TO WO ANGREZ HAI !!!! SEE APPLE'S SLOGAN --"THINK DIFFERENT"

THIS THREAD IS USELESS N WONT BRING ANY RESULTS

No Comment.. I dont' want to heat up things.. lolz..

^^^^ loz agar tere ko comment nahi karna tha to reply hi kyun kiya is thread par :laugh:

A

fun2sh said:
^^^^ loz agar tere ko comment nahi karna tha to reply hi kyun kiya is thread par :laugh:

LOLZZ...

..

fun2sh said:
^^^^ yeah she was not a politician at all like GANDHI

and yeah GANDHI WAS A BIG SUCKER N BIGGEST DEVIL OF THESE TIMES. HE DIDNT HELP IN BRINGIN FREEDOM AT ALL.HE A MERE SELFISH DEVIL WHO HAS NO REGARDS FOR HUMANITY N OUR COUNTRY.

WE SHOULD LANCH A NATION WIDE PROTEST AGAINST HIM AND HIS MAHATAMA-SHIP

are kambakhat!!! tum log jaante hi kitna ho gandhiji ke bare me jo unke piche pade ho. unke jaisa ek kaam bhi tum logo ne nahi kiya hoga????

ITS US WHO GAVE HIM TITLE OF MAHATAMA. HE HIMSILF TOLD THAT HE SHOULD NOT BE CALLED LIKE-WISE.

TUM LOGON SE ACHE TO WO ANGREZ HAI !!!! SEE APPLE'S SLOGAN --"THINK DIFFERENT"

THIS THREAD IS USELESS N WONT BRING ANY RESULTS

I don't want to take part in such type of debate in which some people do not have any idea at all about wht they are speaking.

to ab gandhji ko defend karna bhi muskil hai???

Thats ok but should be clear enough.. dont' you think so ?

Ricky said:
Thats ok but should be clear enough.. dont' you think so ?

wat do u mean?

Well, I had said before Gandhi played an imporatant role in bringing Independence to India also it was because of Gandhi to a very large extent that post Independent India is percieved to be a very peace loving nation by outsiders....maybe he is also partly responsible for India being a Soft State.

Though some of the decisions that he took were questionable...Bhagat Singh being one of it.

A

nightcrawler said:
it was because of Gandhi to a very large extent that post Independent India is percieved to be a very peace loving nation by outsiders....maybe he is also partly responsible for India being a Soft State.

What's the use of it but ?? People of India very well know this does not hold true !! That will be just like giving a FAKE impression. It's useless !!!

shirish_nagar said:
Surely, I did "SOMETHING" for India.

* I never thought that INDIA must be partitioned.
* I never differentiated between Ram and Allah.
* I will never say "Hey RAM" while dieing and still people should call me greatest religion neutral !!

And again from one drama based on Nathuram Godase's life, he asked on question, "why u think, he said 'Hey RAM' when all says HE is a religion neutral" ?

*gandhi never wanted partition . it were jinnah & nehru which left no other choice.
*he never differentiated bwt any relegion. this is clear from various works of his life.
*do you expect him to say"hey RAM Ya ALI OH jesus" after being shot.By the way it is not clear whether he said hey ram or not

Speaking on the topic, who said he was the sole cause of our freedom
He is the Father of our nation cause he belonged to the party which formed the first govt. the contitution.
other leaders opposed the thinking of INC and are thus shadowed.
Gandhi is a figure used by the congress to gather votes.
we should respect leaders like Netaji, Bhagat singh,Azad but that does not mean we should insult gandhiji. He was also an important figure in our independence struggle.
How many of us have looked for information on netaji. Wat were his ideals/thoughts that lead to his actions. Wat did he dream of an independent india and are we doing anything to make this true.
His work was to lead a national party with a large following. It is not an easy task to bring a nation as large as india with such a cultural and ethnic diversity.
the politicians are using him to gain vote.
They are the one who created the image of mahatma in front of us and are using it against us. but that does not mean gandhi was a mean person and that we should hate him.
The truth is due to recent movies like Bhagat singh, heyy ram, etc. & starting of such debate at many places on net people feel that it is modern thinking to hate gandhi.
that it is old thinking to respect gandhi. talking among friends saying insults to gandhi seems a good thing nowadays.
while the truth is we do not want to do anything for the nation.

DID gandhi ever say he was the sole reason of our Freedom??? It's the political setup that says so.

R

Gandhi I would say was an exceptional man, about 2-3 yrs ago if I was asked this same thing I would have promptly replied as Gandhi was a A*****, but during the course of the years I began to understand him better. In some manners I would say that he had almost enlightened himself, because to follow non-violence & all the philosophies that he followed is almost impossible.

For the partition part, people blame him entirely for it but you should know that he never willingly agreed to it. To stop all the violence occuring he had to give consent. First I also blamed him like others entirely, but after understanding the conditions under which he gave his consent I know understand it.

If you people really want a good insight on his life you should watch Richard Attenborugh's movie 'Gandhi'. A masterpiece of celluloid & a perfect portrayal of the man.

Ultimatly it was never his wish to be called as Mahatma, it was the people who began to refer to him in that manner, similar to the fashion that people started calling Jesus Christ a god, when he was just a man sent here to do his bidding because of which he was persecuted.

T

he was a great man...before you people insult him more think would you give up your whole life for a cause...he was from a well off family...studied law...he had a bright future ahead of him yet he dedicated his whole life for his country...he could have lived in South Africa or London yet he lived in Sabarmati Ashram with people from all casts(which was unthinkable at that time)...went on hunger strikes for causes that were not his own...agreed he was not the only reason but he was the biggest reason we got our indipendence...just show some respect towards the man...

C

Gandhi was an Idiot and an ultimate opportunist. He was responsible for the death of Bhagat Singh, Chandrashekhar Azad, Rajguru, Sukhdev and many other people. He divided punjab and made Pakistan. He only thought about himself not about the country. He just wanted his party to have power, that's why he removed everybody who came in his path cleverly. A DEVIL IN DISGUISE :evil:

T

Cerebral Assasin said:
Gandhi was an Idiot and an ultimate opportunist. He was responsible for the death of Bhagat Singh, Chandrashekhar Azad, Rajguru, Sukhdev and many other people. He divided punjab and made Pakistan. He only thought about himself not about the country. He just wanted his party to have power, that's why he removed everybody who came in his path cleverly. A DEVIL IN DISGUISE

man your brain is so screwed up you cant see the truth...give me a single proof that Gandhi was responsible for the death of those men...those men knew what they were doing...Gandhi never agreed with violence...it was Jinnah and the British who divided India and created pakistan...if he only thought about himself then we would not be having this discussion cause the man whom we are talking about would have never returned to India and would have stayed in South Africa...so chill and read some literature about him...

thepirateboy said:
... it was Jinnah and the British who divided India and created pakistan...

and do u know, who gave the FUND to Pakistan at the time of division ?

neelu09 said:
*do you expect him to say"hey RAM Ya ALI OH jesus" after being shot..

One way.. Yeh... surely... HE MUST SAY if he is Religion-Nuetral
Another way... No... But he shouldn't say HEY RAM too.

T

shirish_nagar said:
and do u know, who gave the FUND to Pakistan at the time of division ?

it was a curtsy on India's behalf...India had to give Pakistan the money...think of the situation at that time...there was no war between India and pakistan at that time...all the world was wathching the birth of these two countries...but I agree we were fools by giving them the funds but it had to be done...

R

Gandhi advised the Indian government to give aid to Pakistan, because he thought that they will accept it as a good will gesture & continue to remain friendly with us. Which as we all know was the biggest delusion.

The only good that country will ever be is when it will be destroyed.
Like how India trains engineers to create stuff, pakistan creates the so called 'jehadis' to destroy stuff. A perfect balance.

A

Gandhi was a good social reformer, but when it comes to politics and Indian interest and achieving freedom,I must admit,he was a dampner..Taking no credits away from him or his school of believers it can be safely said that he did more harm than good by co-operating with the Britishers to divide the country on the basis of some damn religion! Freedom was sure to come sooner or later at that part of the time[He would have been a fool not to guess that standing in 1940's],but what he did by helping India to be free after getting divided has given rise to problems which we are still now suffering from,and perhaps will be doing it for many hundreds of years still to come as well. And not only to us Indians, this act of division which gave birth to the greatest terrorist nation of the world is now threatening the whole world! So,it can be clearly understood that it would have been much better had Gandhi never played a single role in India's fight to freedom,which really never been achieved fully as was expected with a divided and weakened India !! India would have been a better place with no so called "service" of this "Father Of The Nation" to this great nation,as the good he did was to the backward class people as a social reformer,and that could always had been looked after by someone else later as has been seen so many times in India history.But being in Politics,he really screwed India up a lot than anyone could have ever expected.So,where was his real contribution as well as Nehru's ? They have largely acted for their own selfish needs,which was fame,publicity and gaining prominence among the Indian political fraternity and nothing else at that time,and did a little for India's true well being as a nation...... What do you all think,fellas ?

i believe Mahatma Gandhi did not give us freedom. the reasons we got freedom were.

1. Germany Kicked british A** sooo much in WWII they(british) didnt have enuf manpower to rule over so many countries in the world. Thats why u will notice many countries got independence from the british between 1945 to 1950.

2. in addition to the above, the UN told the britishers to give up the colonies.

in short he did fight for indian independence....but really i dont give him the credit...

and also it was he who put it in Jinnah's mind that india and pakistan shud be separate. Mahatma Gandhi is the one becos of whom india and pakistan are fighting today.