Subtitle for English Movies on TV - Ur Take ??

Hi all....

I have been recently seeing more subtitle emerging in many english movie channels

for many these subtitle can really be a great distracting factor...

and isnt that odd to see a eng sub to eng film ?? which should be like a tamil sub for eng film or so...

my question here is ... wht do u guys think ..

share ur experience..

for me ...

Subtitle on TV is disgusting and a f$$$$ distractor

yeah....but there are many of my frnds who dont watch a eng movie without a subtitle....so its a boon to them i guess

can they ask for subtitles in theatre.... ( not being offensive though )

Yes English subs for English films. I hate them,but then while not everyone can follow American or British accents, i wonder if they can read as fast

NucleusKore said:
Yes English subs for English films. I hate them,but then while not everyone can follow American or British accents, i wonder if they can read as fast

a very good point indeed....

reading stuff ... +10

NucleusKore said:
Yes English subs for English films. I hate them,but then while not everyone can follow American or British accents, i wonder if they can read as fast

And if they CAN read that fast, I wonder how much of the movie they can actually SEE!!! Or is it that they'll tell you each and every dialogue from the movie afterwards, but won't be able to tell what Katrina looked like in the movie

I love subtitles. It helps me grasp some very subtle speech sounds. Off late I have been relying far too much on it. I usually don't require it when the sound output is very clear but if I watch it on my TV which doesn't have very good vocal sound output, I need subtitles to help. So I don't see a reason why they shouldn't be there. BTW there are a large number of audience now watching these foreign movie channels & not everyone has the ability to get each sound properly. Some of my fellow buddies who didn't have any interest of watching Hollywood films always used to crib of not understanding the movie & now they pick everything up pretty easily thanks to these subs.

allwyndlima said:
I love subtitles. It helps me grasp some very subtle speech sounds. Off late I have been relying far too much on it. I usually don't require it when the sound output is very clear but if I watch it on my TV which doesn't have very good vocal sound output, I need subtitles to help. So I don't see a reason why they shouldn't be there. BTW there are a large number of audience now watching these foreign movie channels & not everyone has the ability to get each sound properly. Some of my fellow buddies who didn't have any interest of watching Hollywood films always used to crib of not understanding the movie & now they pick everything up pretty easily thanks to these subs.

i think it shouldn't be there ...

it kills the exictement the movie brings in

think of some important dialogues .. where they want to tell u who killed the girl .. the subs tell us before hand , way before the actor says it .. is that irritating.. and particularly when everything is quite and nothing there to note except suddenly this sub pops up and says it .. WHAT A NICE F$$$$$ SPOILER !!!!

if someone cant understand .. there are always local language channels showing them in local language..like star Vijay showing eng movie in native language on weekends...

but one who have setup nice home theatre ..and want to enjoy just like a theatre.. SUBS are annoyance...!!!

and more over in dishtv/tata/big/etc where there is a special function for subs... these operators are forcing them on to the screen instead of giving the viewers wht they want...

and more over HBO have started to show movies in hindi .. which is very uncomformy for other language people....and no of movies shown is increasing ...

naveen_reloaded said:
think of some important dialogues .. where they want to tell u who killed the girl .. the subs tell us before hand , way before the actor says it .. is that irritating.

Example?

naveen_reloaded said:
if someone cant understand .. there are always local language channels showing them in local language..like star Vijay showing eng movie in native language on weekends...

I didn't mean non-English speakers but people who know English to a certain degree but yet fail to sometimes grasp some tough phrases/words/joke etc. Can you relay me the entire explanation of the words uttered from the mouth of The Architect during his conversation in the movie with Neo in Matrix Reloaded? That AFAIK requires someone grasping a very high sense of vocabulary. So 90% people let it go without even knowing the true meaning of that scene.

naveen_reloaded said:
but one who have setup nice home theatre ..and want to enjoy just like a theatre.. SUBS are annoyance...!!!

Not everyone has the luxury of a 5.1 surround. BTW isn't this about the subtitles irritating you on HBO or in general? People who are fond of subs just switch it on. It's not implied on them on a DVD. Even if you download a movie over the internet it's never hard coded except for some rare ones.

naveen_reloaded said:
and more over in dishtv/tata/big/etc where there is a special function for subs... these operators are forcing them on to the screen instead of giving the viewers wht they want...

Yes well that's how our local cable works. They force hindi dubbing in channels like Discovery, Cartoon Network & National Geographic. So well nothing much you can do about it.

naveen_reloaded said:
and more over HBO have started to show movies in hindi .. which is very uncomformy for other language people....and no of movies shown is increasing ...

Again can you tell me any show in particular?

allwyndlima said:
Example?

sorry forgot to notte it down.. it was a long time .. may be someone can help me .... hi hi

I didn't mean non-English speakers but people who know English to a certain degree but yet fail to sometimes grasp some tough phrases/words/joke etc. Can you relay me the entire explanation of the words uttered from the mouth of The Architect during his conversation in the movie with Neo in Matrix Reloaded? That AFAIK requires someone grasping a very high sense of vocabulary. So 90% people let it go without even knowing the true meaning of that scene.

ya ... wht if i want to see with ZEE TV with all time hindi sub on ??do u like it ??? just because i want to learn.... comeon ... now ...

for me the other option would be to provide users to select the sub instead of forcing it on to the screen

Not everyone has the luxury of a 5.1 surround. BTW isn't this about the subtitles irritating you on HBO or in general? People who are fond of subs just switch it on. It's not implied on them on a DVD. Even if you download a movie over the internet it's never hard coded except for some rare ones.

ya i agree .. but isnt it i paid dishtv or wtever to get me that effect ???
and regarding sub.. i use it very very rarely .. and why should anyone need it when u understand them ... ya i agree some scenes are very tough though.. but thats the way u learn ... i am not talking about english alone .. it suites all other too... subs kills.. the learning skill...

Yes well that's how our local cable works. They force hindi dubbing in channels like Discovery, Cartoon Network & National Geographic. So well nothing much you can do about it.

dishtv isnt a local cable ... ok even if u consider local cable.. i dont know anyone in my state doing that ... sorry bro... where are u from ( no offfensive bro )

Again can you tell me any show in particular?

ok i will note it next time and will tell ya./

naveen_reloaded said:
ya ... wht if i want to see with ZEE TV with all time hindi sub on ??do u like it ??? just because i want to learn.... comeon ... now ...

The question was about English language subs for English language movies & not about regional languages. English was never our first language or was it? It's not like only 'I want to lean' but it's for 'people' who want to understand it in a better manner. I don't see what's so bad about it.

ya i agree .. but isnt it i paid dishtv or wtever to get me that effect ???

Didn't really understand you?

and regarding sub.. i use it very very rarely .. and why should anyone need it when u understand them ... ya i agree some scenes are very tough though.. but thats the way u learn ... i am not talking about english alone .. it suites all other too... subs kills.. the learning skill...

It's an aid for people who want understand more about the dialogues uttered. I find it hard to grasp the British accent as they stress on some words with very high tone. Unless it's written out you won't get it. Who said it kills the learning skill? No matter how good you are at English, you sometimes need to be aided with certain things. Also not all movies on HBO have subtitles embedded to them.

dishtv isnt a local cable ... ok even if u consider local cable.. i dont know anyone in my state doing that ... sorry bro... where are u from ( no offfensive bro )

None taken. I am from Mumbai. Out here some of the local cable owners switch the audio into Hindi for better acceptance from locals. So you're stuck with weird dubbing.

ok i will note it next time and will tell ya./

I'll wait.

allwyndlima said:
The question was about English language subs for English language movies & not about regional languages. English was never our first language or was it? It's not like only 'I want to lean' but it's for 'people' who want to understand it in a better manner. I don't see what's so bad about it.

its simple bro .. i cant go into a hindi film showing theatre and ask for subs...
if u dont know the lang .. u learn .. and i cant go in for a Tamil film and ask for tamil subs... or can u ask for Hindi subs for Hindi film ???

dont u just feel that its weird ??

Didn't really understand you?

bro i wanted a best TV viewing experience ... i hope u get me now

It's an aid for people who want understand more about the dialogues uttered. I find it hard to grasp the British accent as they stress on some words with very high tone. Unless it's written out you won't get it. Who said it kills the learning skill? No matter how good you are at English, you sometimes need to be aided with certain things. Also not all movies on HBO have subtitles embedded to them.

ya even i found it hard when i saw office season 1 ( British version ) man those are tough English... but i tried to understand... it was difficult .. but i think its always better to try to understand instead of seeking help of subs...
this way u will be able to cope up with film when subs aren't available or where u cant request one ( theatre , friends home , etc etc... )

None taken. I am from Mumbai. Out here some of the local cable owners switch the audio into Hindi for better acceptance from locals. So you're stuck with weird dubbing.

thanks bro... first for taking it casually ...
thats pity bro.. ya now i remember here too that cartoon channels comes only in Tamil... some look good .. but the real goodness of English was lost...
sorry for not mentioning this before .. i just forgot... coz they didn't put discovery , animal on Tamil ...

I'll wait.

Subtitles are wonderful. I have been watching several TV shows, and most of them with subtitles.

Subtitles are the best to know what exactly a person is talking in their accent. Now, naveen_reloaded, I challenge you to watch Pulp Fiction without subtitles, and try to figure out what is said in the first scene, before the theme music. I have watched it several times, and several friends have seen it too, but without subs, its totally impossible to understand that accent.

I have a good accent, a cross between US and UK. How do you hope to get a good accent without understanding it when someone speaks? Most of us want to go abroad, for education, for work, or for tourism. What is the point if you cannot communicate with people there properly? Its understandable if you're visiting Japan or China, which is an entirely different language, but English is something we've been learning since kindergarten, what is the point of calling it a universal language when you can only understand the english spoken in certain parts of the world?

Subtitles are the most helpful additions to any video, and subtitles can improve your english drastically and dramatically. Try watching a movie/TV show first without subs, then with subs. You'll notice you have missed out a big part of the communication, and can understand it much better.

naveen_reloaded said:
its simple bro .. i cant go into a hindi film showing theatre and ask for subs...
if u dont know the lang .. u learn .. and i cant go in for a Tamil film and ask for tamil subs... or can u ask for Hindi subs for Hindi film ???

dont u just feel that its weird ??

You can't include theatre in this Naveen. I have yet to see any English movie being screened with English subtitles in a cinema. TV & DVD's are usually applicable to mass audience. In this country where people watching English movies is marginally less compared to the people watching other languages. Even though many tend to speak the language & understand it as well they still need help in understanding how it's spoken in foreign countries. Even though it's 'English' the accent plays a major role out here. It's not only in India but elsewhere as well. I'll give you a small example. I used to work for an Australian contact centre & people used to call us & we had to greet them & then let them know of our names. Names could be either pseudo or real. People out there usually found it hard to spell out certain names. No matter how clear your accent was they would still want it phonetically relayed or they just pass on it.

What I'm trying to say is that English is spoken universally but the way it is spoken also matters. Some people are very quick at understanding it being spoken in different accents but the others may take time to understand & the handful would just say "WTF did he say?" & move on.

ya even i found it hard when i saw office season 1 ( British version ) man those are tough English... but i tried to understand... it was difficult .. but i think its always better to try to understand instead of seeking help of subs...
this way u will be able to cope up with film when subs aren't available or where u cant request one ( theatre , friends home , etc etc... )

Alright let's take it this way. You have a movie on HBO & there are no subs. If you miss a dialogue or didn't understand it, do you have the option to rewind it & view it again? You'll have to wait for the whole movie to telecast all over again & wait for that scene, right? Or try to get that information from somewhere. In a DVD, I can forward & rewind to that scene & concentrate on it. Now add subs & tell me how easy it would be? It's not like you're cheating or something. You have the option to explore those things yourself.

The point is where you need help, you can help yourself by getting those subs. On Television sadly I don't know if there is an option to turn them off. Anyway ultimately it's the broadcasters call to add/remove subtitles. If you noticed this was a trend started by Zee Studio & HBO just followed suit. Star Movies still hasn't changed it's format. I don't watch TV at all but still like to have these subtitles somewhere down the line. May be not for every movie but for some.

thanks bro... first for taking it casually ...
thats pity bro.. ya now i remember here too that cartoon channels comes only in Tamil... some look good .. but the real goodness of English was lost...
sorry for not mentioning this before .. i just forgot... coz they didn't put discovery , animal on Tamil ...

Anytime. After all it's just a healthy debate isn't it?

I always watch English movies with subtitles which I download. And yes, I can read that fast and watch the movie well too. Its a matter of habit.

But I don't favour subtitles on movies airing on TV. Not everyone likes subtitles.

allwyndlima said:
You can't include theatre in this Naveen. I have yet to see any English movie being screened with English subtitles in a cinema. TV & DVD's are usually applicable to mass audience. In this country where people watching English movies is marginally less compared to the people watching other languages. Even though many tend to speak the language & understand it as well they still need help in understanding how it's spoken in foreign countries. Even though it's 'English' the accent plays a major role out here. It's not only in India but elsewhere as well. I'll give you a small example. I used to work for an Australian contact centre & people used to call us & we had to greet them & then let them know of our names. Names could be either pseudo or real. People out there usually found it hard to spell out certain names. No matter how clear your accent was they would still want it phonetically relayed or they just pass on it.

What I'm trying to say is that English is spoken universally but the way it is spoken also matters. Some people are very quick at understanding it being spoken in different accents but the others may take time to understand & the handful would just say "WTF did he say?" & move on.

i agree with you .. but how many ascent of eng do to come across in movies ?? may be 2-5 to the most... and all that u can get used if u watch two or three movies in those ascent..subs will only kill the learning and understanding skill of one ... sub will never help u learn better.. instead it will make one dependant on the subs to understand and over the period.. it will be difficult for one to understand without subs.. just think it over.. u will know ...

Alright let's take it this way. You have a movie on HBO & there are no subs. If you miss a dialogue or didn't understand it, do you have the option to rewind it & view it again? You'll have to wait for the whole movie to telecast all over again & wait for that scene, right? Or try to get that information from somewhere. In a DVD, I can forward & rewind to that scene & concentrate on it. Now add subs & tell me how easy it would be? It's not like you're cheating or something. You have the option to explore those things yourself.

The point is where you need help, you can help yourself by getting those subs. On Television sadly I don't know if there is an option to turn them off. Anyway ultimately it's the broadcasters call to add/remove subtitles. If you noticed this was a trend started by Zee Studio & HBO just followed suit. Star Movies still hasn't changed it's format. I don't watch TV at all but still like to have these subtitles somewhere down the line. May be not for every movie but for some.

if i miss a dialogue and its very important one i would then go online to know wht happened like imdb or someother site...
seriuosly bro.. but i have never done ... more over my expirience is more important than few dialogues.. yes i do agree dialogues play a important part.. but i watch eng movies mainly for thies stunning effect and other stuff... this doesnt mean i dont care about dialogues....

all i want tosay is .. SUBs should never be forced.. it should be given as " OPTIONS ".. the one who are mainly affected are the hardcore movie lovers .. who dont like sh%tty text running below and breaking interesting stuff and acting like a small " spoiler tool"

Anytime. After all it's just a healthy debate isn't it?

i love healthy debate bro....

naveen_reloaded said:
i agree with you .. but how many ascent of eng do to come across in movies ?? may be 2-5 to the most... and all that u can get used if u watch two or three movies in those ascent..subs will only kill the learning and understanding skill of one ... sub will never help u learn better.. instead it will make one dependant on the subs to understand and over the period.. it will be difficult for one to understand without subs.. just think it over.. u will know ...

Not really. If you take a Chris Tucker style speech then you'll need to refer to some text as to what he yaps most of the time. Once you read through them you'll know how funny they sound, instead of just watching him yap & laugh.

I, personally, alternate between subs & without subs. It depends on my mood & also the quality of the audio. If it's perfectly audible then I wouldn't need subs. Also depends on the movie I'm watching. If it involves soft spoken dialogues then probably I'll need it. I can read & watch the movie at equal speed. I don't miss anything. Also I don't have to read the full sentence but just some words which I can't grasp. I don't feel this kills my "learning skill" at all. Infact I get to learn more with these subs being included which otherwise people would ignore & let go. Like some complex words which don't really connect to the storyline but is good for your vocabulary.

if i miss a dialogue and its very important one i would then go online to know wht happened like imdb or someother site...
seriuosly bro.. but i have never done ... more over my expirience is more important than few dialogues.. yes i do agree dialogues play a important part.. but i watch eng movies mainly for thies stunning effect and other stuff... this doesnt mean i dont care about dialogues....

That's what I do at times as well. But not for the dialogue but for the entire scene. Most of the times it's something said in the movie & I fail to catch it. Hence getting lost at some part. Also saying that watching a movie just for the effects & other stuff & not caring about the dialogue just shows you're only interested in the "Big Bam Boom" effect. So that way you'll enjoy Matrix only for it's stunts & Gladiator only for it's fights which is really sad. Dialogues are something which make up the entire movie. If you don't play close attention then the movie isn't worth watching unless it's only relying on pure action. Like the Tony Jaa's ONG BAK & Tom Yum Goong. I didn't care about the dialogues but only wanted to see him beat the living crap out of everyone on the screen.

all i want tosay is .. SUBs should never be forced.. it should be given as " OPTIONS ".. the one who are mainly affected are the hardcore movie lovers .. who dont like sh%tty text running below and breaking interesting stuff and acting like a small " spoiler tool"

Agreed. I don't watch much TV anyway so doesn't really bother me much. Even if it does have subs I know how to pay attention to the movie.

I think its totally dumb to have subs in video.
Subtitles should always be a seperate track like audio and video.

allwyndlima said:
Not really. If you take a Chris Tucker style speech then you'll need to refer to some text as to what he yaps most of the time. Once you read through them you'll know how funny they sound, instead of just watching him yap & laugh.

I, personally, alternate between subs & without subs. It depends on my mood & also the quality of the audio. If it's perfectly audible then I wouldn't need subs. Also depends on the movie I'm watching. If it involves soft spoken dialogues then probably I'll need it. I can read & watch the movie at equal speed. I don't miss anything. Also I don't have to read the full sentence but just some words which I can't grasp. I don't feel this kills my "learning skill" at all. Infact I get to learn more with these subs being included which otherwise people would ignore & let go. Like some complex words which don't really connect to the storyline but is good for your vocabulary.

ya its true.. and i agree that those kinda dialogues should never been seen with subs .. coz if u know wht is going to come out of the actor... it spoils the whole damn dialogue effect and spoils everything....

That's what I do at times as well. But not for the dialogue but for the entire scene. Most of the times it's something said in the movie & I fail to catch it. Hence getting lost at some part. Also saying that watching a movie just for the effects & other stuff & not caring about the dialogue just shows you're only interested in the "Big Bam Boom" effect. So that way you'll enjoy Matrix only for it's stunts & Gladiator only for it's fights which is really sad. Dialogues are something which make up the entire movie. If you don't play close attention then the movie isn't worth watching unless it's only relying on pure action. Like the Tony Jaa's ONG BAK & Tom Yum Goong. I didn't care about the dialogues but only wanted to see him beat the living crap out of everyone on the screen.

buddy i love both .. i love movie like bucket list , 12 angry men , shindlers list ,..etc,etc... in these film i love to see the dialogues delevired with me seeeing thier expression and other stuff... if i happen to see the film with subs ... i cant concentrate on those minute, extraordinary facial expression , the way they deliver etc.... thats why i hate subs.. i simply just distracts u from seeing the real and main things...

MetalheadGautham said:
I think its totally dumb to have subs in video.
Subtitles should always be a seperate track like audio and video.

i totally agree with ya ....

eng subs for eng subs are very nice if we have to watch movie without disturbing others (mute) or in few movies where sound isnt necessary

LOL ^^^^

agree with u ... :-D

max_demon said:
or in few movies where sound isnt necessary

Then why subs

very very distracting

I generally like to use subs only when I'm not able to clearly understand what the actors are saying. But honestly, it's very distracting while watching TV.

lolz...i rarely watch idiot box. But its plain stupid to provide subtitle in same language.

i love subtitles for english movies..

i cant understand what they most of the time. they are too fast. so subtitles are a boon for me. they help me understand the movie completely. i hope more movies are shown with subtitles. right now, only HBO shows them for a few movies...

aand include zee mgm in ur list...

hbo sucks at clarity... so i least watch it and now with subs.. they suck more....

hope star keeps its value !!!

I would prefer subtitles.. Its not just the accent.. Each actor/actress has his / her own way of delivering the dialogues.. Its a little difficult to follow for all.
Rather than questioning whether subtitles are needed or not, it is better to ask/demand for the option of turning on/off subtitles. Subtitles should be provided for all films..! The choice of whether you want it or not should be with the audience.

@nix: Watch Zee Studio.. They show most of the films with subtitles.. And of course my favorite channel, World Movies, shows subtitles.. but they have to..

yes thats wht i have been saying .. just like in DVD where u can have subs or not ...

isnt that a special feature in DTH ???

but none of the channels are giving subs

well whats the point of fighting over here? Whether u like it or not these channels dont give a damn.. they arent gonna stop showing subtitles just coz of u. Personally i hate them and would prefer if they gave us an option to enable or disable them at our will which i think is possible on dth n cas.

Now HBO shows subtitles for all movies just like Zee studio.... just hoping that Star Movies and Pix dont follow suit.

^^True!!! I was just about to say that!!!

But SNATCH on TV - Subtitle = Way to hard to grasp!!!!

Yippie kay-yay.... now even Star Movies has started showing subtitles with even LARGER font. Now only Sony Pix is left and maybe even Star World if they too decide that putting stupid English subtitles for English movies is gonna get them more viewers.

TV viewing in India now officially s|_|cks. Now where did i save those torrents?

i LOVE Subtitles... yeah... That way I can use more of my senses to enjoy the stuff.

What actually should be done for THOSE who are distracted is; provide it in a seaprate track like Audio, Video.. Just like MetalheadGautham said.

its useful when udon't understand a particular word or sentence...lol but have to admit whenever these channels bring the subtitles...the censorship of few words are pretty weird & funny...

if you don't like 'em, keep your eyes away

Same language Subs help folks with hearing disabilities enjoy movies

I wonder why they don't bring in subs on Hindi and regional language channels too

Most TVs anyway have bad SQ , combine that with the highly compressed audio available on most TV channels and most dialog sounds muffled and garbled ..

And please, same language subs are in no way comparable to dubbed flicks
Most vernacular translation jobs are very badly botched

I guess some folks get some kind of twisted faux elitist kick by claiming that subtitles ruin their experience, coz they, after all do not need those subs even when watching Chris Tucker whine away to glory while wincing and focusing hard to catch the dialogs coming via some $hitty pair of speakers :lol:

nobody is against subs.. even i enable subs sometimes when watching movies on my PC. But forcing them down our throat is wrong. Keep them optional as an added feature on DTH n CAS. People who need them can enable them if n when they want.

Whats the point of buying a 32 inch LCD+ some DTH service n watching Transformers with those subs which i dont need spoiling my viewing experience?

For now I don't see them (broadcasters) including subtitles as a separate source like audio. May be in future they might.

Subs are really good for people who download shows or movies from the internet. I wouldnt know about getting them on the local TV. Only a small minority of the TV shows in India are really worth watching.

First think I do after downloading a movie from net is download a subtitle for the same from opentitles.org. Without subtitles I wont watch any of the english movie, its hard for me atleast to follow the voice conversation.
Just bcoz of subtitles I started watching HBO channels nowadays.

Whats wrong in those subtitles? If you dont like it, don't watch the subtitles. It just takes a little space. Yah.. but large font is not okay!

superczar said:
if you don't like 'em, keep your eyes away

Same language Subs help folks with hearing disabilities enjoy movies

I wonder why they don't bring in subs on Hindi and regional language channels too

Most TVs anyway have bad SQ , combine that with the highly compressed audio available on most TV channels and most dialog sounds muffled and garbled ..

And please, same language subs are in no way comparable to dubbed flicks
Most vernacular translation jobs are very badly botched

I guess some folks get some kind of twisted faux elitist kick by claiming that subtitles ruin their experience, coz they, after all do not need those subs even when watching Chris Tucker whine away to glory while wincing and focusing hard to catch the dialogs coming via some $hitty pair of speakers

keep ur eyes away ???? dude how is it possible to keep away the subs .. when itss covering nearly 1/4th of the screen ...

Subtitles are the way to go.
Its a shame tv channels took forever to wake up to them.
Without subtitles you miss many things..lil jokes , cultural references etc

There is a Subtitle On/Off option in Digital cable transmission. But the channels don't
provide them. We need a seperate "track" or "layer" (whatever the term is). Also Discovery is the only channel I so far come across which transmits Hindi and English audio which we can choose.

^^ all educational and cartoon channels do that like Animal Planet, NGC, CN, Disney History etc.

@chesss
and yes nobody minds subs as long as they are optional(actually they are really useful for some movies where the dialogue is hard to grasp)
......but forced subs is not the way to go dude.

^but I cld say the same thing ..forced absence of subtitles is not the way to go...

*www.youtube.com/watch?v=Si6CHruMn7c